I have every incentive to keep my accounts with Citibank. Both my debit card and credit card are AAdvantage cards, earning me a frequent flier mile for every buck I spend. I've amassed a shitload of miles in the two years I've had them.
But, when I get back from Portland, they're history.
Before the holiday weekend, on 7/2, I deposited an advance from my company (against my OSCON expenses). On 7/7, I transferred that money to my credit card, so that I'd be able to pay for my hotel. On 7/9, I had an automated payment to my auto-loan company.
Except that they waited until 7/11 to clear the funds from the initial deposit. A check drawn on a local company took them that long to clear. And they charged me an overdraft fee to boot.
So, I called them up. Because that's what I do when companies screw up.
... followed, of course, with sharing the conversation with you fine folks.
CSR [in thick Indian accent you can barely understand]: May I have your Citicard number please?
Derek: blahblahblah
CSR: can you repeat that?
Derek: blahblahblah
CSR: can you repeat that?
Derek: blah....blah.....blah
CSR: How can I help you?
Derek: I made a deposit on 7/2, and by 7/9 it hadn't cleared, and that caused my car-loan payment to bounce, and I'd like to find out why.
CSR: What was the amount of the deposit?
Derek: 1349.99
CSR: And you made that on the 7th of June? [no lie, I have no idea where she pulled that date from, a running theme here is that I have to repeat half of this to her like three or four times because she can't understand english, but I'm just too lazy to type those parts]
Derek: No, on the second of July.
CSR: I don't understand, I show that payment fully cleared as of 7/11.
Derek: Unfortunately, it wasn't fully cleared as of 7/9, and it was a local business check, so it should have cleared almost immediately, and I'd like to figure out why.
CSR: But the funds are available completely.
Derek: They weren't two days ago apparently, and you bounced a payment I made. Incidentally, I find it funny that the day you decided to return the check as NSF is the day you decided to clear the funds that would have made the check not be NSF.
CSR: One second sir, while I look into this.
...about three hundred actual seconds pass...
CSR: Sir, yes, I investigated, and if the check is drawn on a local bank, it can take five business days to clear.
Derek: Five business days? For a local check? Since when?
CSR: It depends on the amount of the check, sir.
Derek: [looking at a calendar] OK, assuming for the moment that I think that's right, and I don't, why didn't the check clear on the 9th, the same day as my payment?
CSR: It would clear on the 11th, you see, because of the holiday.
Derek: How long is the holiday? One day, right?
CSR: Yes, sir.
Derek: Well, as I count it, the 2nd, 3rd, 7th, 8th, and then finally the 9th, would be the five business days, so why exactly did Citibank decide to not make the money available until the 11th, the seventh business day?
CSR: Because the fifth business day would be the eleventh.
Derek: By what bizarre mathematical formula? Do you have a calendar on your desk? Follow along... 2nd-first day. 3rd-second day. 7th-third day. 8th-fourth day. 9th-fifth day. So, again, why were those funds held until the 11th?
CSR: One second please.
... about 300 more seconds ...
CSR: Sir, the hold does not begin until the day after the deposit, so they were held on the 3rd, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, and then made available on the 11th.
Derek: That makes absolutely no sense.
CSR: That's the way they calculate it, sir.
Derek: By that logic, you weren't holding my funds at all on the 2nd, and if I'd've been quick, I could have quickly used them all up. But that's not what happened, you did hold the funds on the 2nd. And you can hold them until the fifth day, so on the fifth day - the 9th - you should have released them.
CSR: I don't know what to tell you, sir.
Derek: You can tell me how you're going to solve this screw-up, since now my car-loan people are going to think I'm a deadbeat when in fact it's you guys who screwed up.
CSR: Yes, sir.
Derek: "Yes, sir?" That's not an answer. How are you going to make this right?
CSR: Sir, I'm not certain how I can --
Derek: May I please speak to a supervisor?
CSR: I can --
Derek: A supervisor please.
CSR: One second.
... as expected, many more seconds ...
CSR: There are no supervisors available to talk to you, sir. But as I said, the funds would not be available until the 11th
Derek: [after much arguing as she repeats her stupidity over and over again] Can I just speak to someone else, because I'm obviously just not getting through to you the gravity of the situation.
CSR: Hold, please.
... muzak ...
CSR2: This is so-and-so, what exactly would you like me to do? (another female, another Indian accent, not sure why there's so many Indian women working 3rd shift in the call-center, that's an odd demographic)
Derek: I'd like you to credit back the overdraft charge, and draft a letter of apology for your mistake so that I can present that to my lender and hopefully they won't try to repossess my car or anything because of your screw-up.
CSR2: I can put in a request for the letter, and a request for the credit, but I could not actually confirm the credit.
Derek: Why not?
CSR2: Because it requires a supervisor to approve a credit.
Derek: Wait, you're there on a night-shift, taking calls from customers, calls which potentially might require a supervisor to handle to completion, and they don't have supervisors to make that happen?
CSR2: No sir, supervisors are available from 7AM CST to [someothertime]
Derek: So basically, it's not 24 hour customer service, it's business-hours customer service and after hours secretarial service.
CSR2: Sir, I'm capable of handling many types of requests, but cannot reverse the service charge.
Derek: Right, so for the purposes of this customer service call, you're completely unable to actually provide "Service".
[I should note, it's also around this time that I start to wonder why, if there are no such thing as night-shift supervisors, CSR1 took five minutes to come back and tell me there were no supervisors available]
CSR2: If you'd like to call back later, there should be supervisors available, who could handle your request.
Derek: No, I'd like the supervisor to call me back.
CSR2: What number can they reach you at ?
Derek: [cel-phone-number]
CSR2: OK, sir, one second please.... [hold-time] ... ok, sir, I've put in a request for that apology letter, and a note for a supervisor to call you back within 24 hours, is there anything else?
Derek: Nope, guess not.
CSR2: Thanks for calling Citibank. click
[insert sound of Derek banging his head against the wall in frustration with the bank he was really starting to like]
I really hate banks. Why?
"Banks own you. And they know it."
They know that they all have the same crappy service and the same crappy rules that fuck over the customer worse than a crack-whore.
More importantly, they all know that you can barely survive in modern society without the ability to write and cash checks, or pay with plastic for things like hotels, airfare and car-rentals.
You need them, and they know it, so they've ceased needing to actually care.
It's a catch-22. The smaller banks, who might be predisposed to care, can't offer the services you want (mileage points, debit cards, online banking through Quicken, etc.) .. But, by not having those features, they rule themselves out of getting customers, like me, who would happily pay exorbitant monthly fees, etc., to get a bank that actually cared about its customer.
Maybe I'm abnormal, but here's the truth: I'll pay several times more than average for good, consistent customer service.
And banks just don't give it.
So, do I let Citibank continue to reap the rewards of having me as a customer, or do I yank my accounts and go elsewhere, diminishing my available feature set in the process? I'm torn because, as noted, the chances of my finding anything significantly different, service-wise, are somewhere between dick and zero.
This was definitely a major buzzkill after my night out with Randal Schwartz tonight. :(
Aha, I'd bet this is one of the call centers from india. One of my neighour works there and he had to go though a 3 month course in english and esp how to speak in the american english.
oh well.
You would be highly surprised how many calls we route to India these days.
Also, look into joining a credit union. When they pulled the fiv day crap on me on a government check, I went through the roof. A day later I had the apology letter, the credit, and the number of the local manager who said to call her with ANY problems.
No, I don't get mileage points, but I really don't think I'm missing much there.
Yeah, I believe Citi moved all their call centers to India. Normally they give the reps vocal training, though, so they don't sound like idiots. Certainly grounds for leaving, and sending a letter to the VP of something or other telling them why they lost your business.
My family had alot of similiar problems with the big banks (and even some of the smaller ones) so we actually run most of our transactions through the state credit union. Never had any problems and they're actually people who seem to care...granted I've yet to find an ATM I can pull from without a surcharge but...thats a pretty minimal hassle in my book.
Amen ont he Credit Unions. We use the NC State Employee CU (by virtue of my wife's employment witthe State of NC). We used Wachovia for a long time, but I had the last straw when they decided to charge me $2 to talk to a teller.
I don't care about Credit Cards, though. I go for the best deal I can get there. Just would never keep my savings and checking accounts with a regular bank. You get service feed to death, and "God" help you if you have a problem.
Small banks all the day.. My bank makes out-of-state checks clear in less than 3 days at most.. usually it's the next day.. and if you deposit via atm (which I usually do) first $500 is available immediately out of any check.
I have a business checking account at the evil itself (BofA). They always make the funds from my checks available right away; even when they are $[several months worth of invoices].
- ask
I agree with Brian... Credit unions are the way to go. You sacrifice some conveniences, but get better rates (and I get a helluva lot better customer service than I did when I was with Bank of America). Our CU has a lot of perks, but not airline miles which seems to be important to you.
I have a similar situation. Did you ever find out who the VP of customer relations is for banking, or on line banking? I have searched but can't find the person's name.
Help!
Nicola
CitiBank sucks. I have an AT & T Universal Master
Card that I did not realize was CitiBank. I have
had the card several years and have a high credit
limit. The current balance on the card has a low promotional interest rate of 3.9%. I moved and when I sent my last payment to Citibank, I notified them that I had moved and provided the new address. This was the end of June. By the end of July I had not rec'd a statement. I assumed it was lost in the mail and I would receive another one soon. Finally on July 30th I get this call from a woman saying she is with Citibank and I am behind in my credit card payments. The woman confirmed she had my new address. I asked her to send another statement as I did not receive the current one. The woman was very aggressive and demanding. She insisted I make a payment by phone immediately. Since I had no idea who this person was, I was reluctant to turn over my bank account info. but she was so pushy and threatening. The only way I could get rid of her was to tell her to F-off. I immediately called the customer service number on the back of my card and a man answered with a heavy Indian accent. He pulled up my account and said I was not behind in payments, that my current statement showed a due date at the end of August. I figured end of story. Not so. A few days ago I get another call from Citibank a man who was just as threatening as the first caller. He too was demanding I make a phone payment. I told him Citibank customer service has no record of me being behind in payments. He said he didn't "care" what customer services said, I need to pay NOW. I told him to F-off. I called customer service again. Again a person with a heavy Indian accent answered. I had to go over the story several times and I am not sure he understood what I was trying to ask him. He first stated I was not behind in payments, then stated I was, blah blah. Finally he told me Citibank received my notice of change of address on June 25th, sent a new statement on June 30th to my old address and then updated my new address info on July 7th, but in any event, it's up to me to pay the credit charges regardless if I have a statement or not (yeah I am sure there would be no problem with Citibank crediting payment). The long and short of it Citibank plays these games. I was at a low interest rate, miss one payment and they can jack up the rate to 21%. I paid the full balance and closed the account, but Citibank added additional finance charges ect. I will check all my open credit cards to make sure none of them are Citibank funded.
Yes, I work at Citibank. Just so you know, they do have ONE call center in India that just opened not even a year ago. They have several call centers and only one isn't in America. I hate working because I work in collections. The only reason I stay is because it keeps my butt out of collections. It pays the bills. I look at it from a business point of view and a customer point of view and to be quite honest, I don't agree with some of the things Citibank does. And in your situation, that does suck. But some people absolutly hate Citibank for something stupid and isn't the banks fault, but because it happened to them, they have to blame it on something, and obviously it's going to be Citibank. I guess maybe I'm the only person who thinks of it from a business and customer point of view. But in other situations, I completely agree with the customer. And in collections, I've dealt with so many jerks that I've just learned to think of it as "it's my money, collect on it." I mean, if you borrow thousands of dollars from a company and you don't pay it, there will be consequences. I mean, I'm sure you wouldn't want someone borrowing thousands of dollars from you and they refuse to pay it back. You'd be PISSED! I know I would. It's not just Citibank, but it's any company you'd borrow money from. That's the beauty of collections and reports to the credit bureau.
I'm sorry for rambling on. I do feel bad that that happened to you. Once again, I'm apologizing for something someone else in my company did. There are very few, limited things I can acutally do in my department, and YES a lot of the times managers are busy doing other things like taking other calls or doing something else and it is hard to get managers sometimes, but once again I'm sorry. I hope you have no other problems with your Citibank card as you work to pay it off and finish your business with us.
What pisses me off is that Citibank is selling your personal info to web companies, and anyone else with the fee. So if there is anyone you have ever pissed off in your entire life, they can now easily find you and kill you. Nothing like convenience, aye?!
So if you are like me and say testified in court against dangerous criminals, they would now be able to pull up my age, address, telephone number (unlisted) thanks to the idiots at Citibank. Now if you will excuse me I need to pack, like NOW!